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"Justice PK" update & a review of crime and punishment  

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GMSiddhe
(@eternal-admin)
GameMaster Admin

Historically any player character death that was brought about by criminal behavior and carried out by some version of a sentencing - colloquially referred to as a "Justice PK" - has been granted a VC package.

There have been various rules around those VC packages, and as we're making a small update to the policy, we want to be sure everyone understands exactly what the "Justice PK" encompasses and what rules apply.

With that said, going forward:

- Any character whose story ends in a death carried out by some form of the law or some type of sentencing, will receive a VC package calculated at the current rate.

- Accounts will be limited to one VC package of this type once every two calendar years.

- Examples of law/sentencing that would lead to this award are: trials resulting in a death decree, then carried out by a GMNPC, Legio, or other means (e.g. arena death match) or if, in lieu of trial if an GMNPC finds the preponderance of evidence worthy of issuing a death sentence.

- Characters wishing to @retire while in jail will need staff approval; while retiring a character may be an in-game option to circumvent criminal punishment, it will not be used as a mechanical one.

This is the start to a full review of the law system, jail times, etc. Many of you have submitted feedback on both of these; if you have any thoughts that you hadn't previously shared and would like them considered, now is a great time to share them via suggestion tickets.

-Siddhe

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Posted : 17/02/2021 9:48 pm
ArchMagi
(@archmagi)
Eminent Member

So... the change is, instead of only once in a row, you just need to put two years between... time to train up another bad guy to scary status, and then just do the same thing again.

Got it.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 18/02/2021 3:35 am
Herdias
(@herdias)
Active Member

Just in case someone doesn't know about the wiki (Not mentioned on official website at all)

 

Here is a list of warrantable offenses, jailtimes, and fines for review to make suggestions:

 

* Warrantable offences *
_____________________________________________________
1. Petty Theft 1.6 hrs 50d
2. Larceny 12.0 hrs 300d
3. Heavy Larceny 3 days 1t 500d
4. Damage to Private Property 1 day 200d
5. Theft of Public Property 2 days 1t
6. Damage to Public Property 2 days 1t
7. Minor Possession of Contraband 2 days 1t
8. Major Possession of Contraband 6 days 3t
9. Possession of Outlawed Magical Items 3 days 2t
10. Harassment 1.6 hrs 50d
11. Public Aggression 2.0 hrs 250d
12. Minor Assault 1.6 hrs 150d
13. Major Assault 3.0 hrs 250d
14. Assault of an Official 2 days 2t
15. Assault of a Patrician 2 days 2t
16. Kidnapping and Confinement 4 days 5t
17. Attempted Murder 4 days 5t
18. Murder of a Foreigner 4 days 5t
19. Murder of an Official 12 wks nothing
20. Murder of a Humilore 12 wks nothing
21. Murder of a Honestiore 12 wks nothing
22. Murder of a Patrician 12 wks nothing
23. Banditry 12 wks 5t
24. Impropriety 1.6 hrs 50d
25. Resisting Arrest 1.6 hrs 100d
26. Disturbing the Peace 5.0 hrs 500d
27. Interfering with an Official 4 days 1000d
28. Bribery 4 days 1t
29. Conspiracy to Commit a Crime 4 days 1t
30. Forgery 4 days 1t
31. Impersonation 4 days 1t
32. Concealment of Identity 4 days 1t
33. Impersonation of a Patrician 3 days 2t
34. Fraud 3 days 1t
35. Defrauding the Republic 1 wk 5t
36. Abuse of the Public Trust 1 wk 5t
37. Jail Time Outstanding 10 min nothing
38. Blasphemous Worship and Teachings 1 day 300d
39. Use of Outlawed Magics (Minor) 2 days 1000d
40. Use of Outlawed Magics (Major) 2 wks 10t
41. Blasphemous Propaganda 2 wks 2t
42. Treason 49 wks nothing
43. Enemy of the Republic 49 wks nothing

ReplyQuote
Posted : 19/02/2021 4:44 pm
ArchMagi
(@archmagi)
Eminent Member

ha, it's less of a problem to impersonate a patrician, than to impersonate anyone else.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 19/02/2021 6:39 pm
Kjel
 Kjel
(@kjel)
Active Member

This seems like a solution in search of a problem.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 22/02/2021 3:50 pm
Kjel
 Kjel
(@kjel)
Active Member

Also seems like it's targeting a specific couple of players that enjoy playing specific roles. Maybe we should just limit VCs to once every two years and make it equal for everyone.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 23/02/2021 12:08 am
ArchMagi
(@archmagi)
Eminent Member

griefers aren't welcome anywhere, the fact that they allow and encourage people to sometimes play badguys, speaks louder than your claims of targeting one or two people.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 23/02/2021 7:59 am
Kjel
 Kjel
(@kjel)
Active Member

Griefing isn't welcome? Guess you've never pissed off a constable, legio, org you're part of. I guess we should disable combat and all bandit/brigand NPCs. Cinerans should just give your stuff back if you fall KO in Fran after a careful look over by a healer and give you a free ticket over to Cullidan.

If someone is afk walking somewhere, gets stopped, offered some bad guy good guy rp, doesn't do anything, starts getting wrecked, screams in all caps, and then refuses to participate, that's the end of that interaction. What can bandits do with said stolen loot? Bury it in the woods? That's about it as there's no real way to get it anywhere or do anything with custom items.

The bandit interactions I've seen almost always involve some type of RP. One recent one went as follows:

Guy stopped.

Bad guy: Passage along our road is 500 denars, cough it up and you'll live.

"Good" guy: F*ck you.

"Good" guy immediately thinks aloud: HELP BANDITS ON THE ROAD OMG!!!!

Bad guy: That wasn't very nice.

"Good" guy: You can't do anything to me. (He's right as there's no tongue cuts or any lasting damage done to a character.) He then say on the ground.

"Good" guy looks at bandit and gives out the height and build in think.

Bad guy knocks him out.

"Good" guy complains about being griefed.

 

Don't like conflict or scared that some guy who likes to play bandits might get you? Hire a guard, walk with a friend, ask legio, etc., for an escort. Would be a shame to use what's already in the game to counter something that is quite rare, all things considered.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 23/02/2021 2:28 pm
Ilkilyn
(@ilkilyn)
Active Member

People forget this is a PVP focused game. Sure, I agree it should be more rp than skill based than it currently is, but Even EVE online has mostly safe High Sec for carebears. TEC's safe area is... just the baths

ReplyQuote
Posted : 23/02/2021 3:20 pm
GMSiddhe
(@eternal-admin)
GameMaster Admin
Posted by: @kjel

Also seems like it's targeting a specific couple of players that enjoy playing specific roles. Maybe we should just limit VCs to once every two years and make it equal for everyone.

I think you're reading a lot into the fact that I wanted to ensure everyone is on the same page with how a "Justice PK" works, making a small update, and letting folks know we've started to review the criminal system.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 23/02/2021 3:43 pm
ArchMagi
(@archmagi)
Eminent Member

Kjel, I think you're confusing griefing with playing a bad guy. They are not the same thing.

Griefing is going out of your way to ruin other people's gameplay for no other reason than to ruin other people's gameplay.

playing a bad guy isn't about going out of your way to make people hate the game.

It's VERY possible to play a bad guy, provide danger, and excitement, ruin people's days, but not make them hate coming to the game, and not hate the game itself.

Nobody is saying there shouldn't be risk, or consequences for being a dingus, but that's not the same thing as just playing the game to ruin the experience for anyone, for no reason at all.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 23/02/2021 9:37 pm
Herdias
(@herdias)
Active Member

I'm haven't really come up with a way to achieve this, but it'd be wonderful if we could improve the law system in a way that makes it so "bad guys" don't think "good guys" are punishing or singling them out. There are RL time and money involvement with being arrested and I try my best as a law keeper to make sure they actually deserve being arrested before I slap a silly warrant on.

 

Maybe make fines/punishments less if you're a citizen? 

 

Maybe make it so for minor crimes you have a set amount of time to turn yourself in or pay a hefty fine to avoid jail time with Hanna before the terminator constable NPCs hunt you down?

 

Maybe tone-down terminator constables? 

 

 

ReplyQuote
Posted : 24/02/2021 5:13 pm
fezzik
(@fezzik)
Active Member

@archmagi since you think there are griefers (you first used that word in this post), please elaborate more on why the GMs are implementing this? Is it in response to a specific player/group? Do you have any experience with being griefed, please share if you do. Thank you for sharing in advance!

ReplyQuote
Posted : 24/02/2021 5:40 pm
ArchMagi
(@archmagi)
Eminent Member

@fezzik You should probably re-read the thread. I did not claim there were griefers in the game, or that their weren't griefers in the game. I was responding to someone else's claims that they felt targeted by this change, and how it was obviously NOT targeting them because it in no way limits their ability to play bad guys, in fact it makes it easier for the people who like to play bad guys, to play bad guys.

There is a difference however, between playing a bad guy, and playing a griefer. Someone playing a bad guy should not feel targeted by this change. Someone playing a griefer might though.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 24/02/2021 10:19 pm
fezzik
(@fezzik)
Active Member

@archmagi I would recommend you re-read the thread because @kjel didn't feel targeted, he said it seemed like it was targeted. Then you brought up the G-word. However, i feel enlightened by your explanation and accept your response.

ReplyQuote
Posted : 24/02/2021 11:05 pm
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